December 26th, 2011
|android_raptor||01:01 pm - Dear UC Gundam fandom,|
Why is it that you claim to love complex, morally gray situations, yet when a character you personally dislike is involved they automatically must be the sole cause of everything wrong and can't be interpreted as anything other than evil incarnate? Seriously. Lemme tell ya' Quess Paraya is the sole cause of everything terrible in CCA because she's an obnoxious 13 year-old girl. It's not like the plot revolved around Char wanting to kill billions of people or anything, that's okay because Char is uhmazing and and awesome misunderstood hero who meant well! But oh noez being a realistic 13 year-old is a crime against humanity! The horror!
And lemme tell ya' Ghinius Sakhalin is so completely horrible and shallow and heaven forbid anyone else see him as more complex. It's not like he's shown to be fairly nice for the first half of the series of was given some (albeit somewhat last minute and vague) explanations for his behavior and mental state. Noooo, he's just a shallow monster and anyone who thinks otherwise is just a dumb fangirl overthinking shit. It's okay to go into giant bitch fests about how the EZ8 wouldn't realistically be able to tear off its own arm and over-analysis cartoon robots and splooge all over Norris like the epitome of depth and brilliance, but heaven forbid someone try and argue Ghinius as having depth and being likable to them. What they have to say just can't be canon and thus shouldn't be given any respect because Ghinius isn't a cool ace pilot and heaven forbid someone have *GASP* different opinions in the UC fandom! The horror!
And remember kids, it's okay to condemn and bash a character for things they didn't even do when no one important likes them. Heaven forbid someone do anything remotely close to a popular character though. We just can't have Norris or Aina painted as having any faults other than giving Ghinius the time of day, even though that'd make them more interesting and believable characters. Nope, Aina must be perfect suffering innocent waifu/martyr of tru wub and peace (TM) and Norris must be super cool awesome noble ace and so much deeper than Ghinius despite doing little else than piloting the Gouf Custom. But anyone calling out the fact that accusing Ghinius of raping/abusing Aina or condemning him first and foremost for what happened to the Keregeran is unfair bullshit is just white-washing her astral husbando.
Oh yeah, and backstabbing people makes you completely horrible. Except when you're Char Aznable, then it's 'kay and probably the victims' fault. Char is so much more noble and awesome and not at all guilty of the same crap and more as yucky Ghinius.
This fandom. I love it, but goddamn if it doesn't drive me up a wall sometimes.
Current Mood: annoyed
I'm pretty sure Char Aznable gets a pass for just being Char Aznable, but otherwise, :)
He shouldn't though. Yeah, he's a wonderfully complex and thought-provoking character, but it infuriates me how his rabid fans try to white wash and justify his crimes (I'm sorry, but Garma and Kishiria DID NOT deserve what he did to them. Neither did Quess, or the billions of people he wanted to kill in CCA, and everyone else he hurt during his lifetime). And then they go around and hate on characters like Ghinius for being murderous backstabbers while comparing him to the oh-so noble Char. That's one of the most blatant and obnoxious double standards I've ever seen. And I've seen it pop up a good bit, too.
Yeah, those are just some of the many, many reasons I left the general Gundam fandom behind a long time ago and never looked back. The rabid UC elitist fanboys (especially those who bashed anyone who dared to enjoy an AU series) and Char apologists drove me up the wall, among other things, and it was damn near impossible (at least back then) to be a female in the fandom without being seen as some stereotypical vapid squealing Wing fangirl.
I don't think I can leave, it's become too much a part of my life. Even with all the hate I get for liking/defending Ghinius and other characters they refuse to see as anything other than the worst thing ever I still stick around. Maybe I'm just a masochist? :|
I mean, I feel bad because I've lived up to the vapid fangirl stereotype many times in this fandom (granted I've never cared for Wing and was pretty vocal about it back when). Then again, I got into this fandom at 12 years old. I grew up in this fandom, and like any dumb kid that age I said plenty of stupid shit. I still say stupid shit I think. But I think people are more harsh than necessary when it comes to refusing to listing to anything I have to say.
I know you had a kerfluffle with Gundam.com and left Gundamwatch before it went completely totalitarian. How've you been?
|Date:||December 7th, 2012 07:47 pm (UTC)|| |
The problem with Quess isn't that she's unrealistic, its that she draws attention away from the protagonists who are actually interesting, and turns a good portion of the film into an adolescent melodrama, rather than the epic final confrontation between Char and Amuro.
Also, 08TH MS Team was a 13 ep OAV that came out almost two-decades ago. How can you STILL care what people say about Ghinius? I can't even remember his motivation or what he really did in the plot. I'm not even sure I'm spelling his name right. Maybe find a new character to devote yourself to.
Excuse you honey.
I think Quess is great, because she helps illustrate just how low Char is willing to go when it comes to his goals. She shows just how he uses and abuses people, fucking CHILDREN even, as pilots and doesn't even care when they die.
And hey, CCA came out over 23 years ago. Maybe you should find a new character to bitch about, or a new fandom to like? After all, that makes about as much sense as me dropping everything I feel about a character I adore just because the series is like what, 16 years old? Because you seem to think people should stop caring about stuff once it reaches a certain age, and since CCA is older by all mean I think you should go first.
|Date:||December 7th, 2012 08:08 pm (UTC)|| |
Quess in theory makes sense as a character, but the amount of screentime she takes up is self-indulgent on the part of Tomino. Chars Counterattack was meant to resolve the character of arc of Char and Amuro; instead it focuses on the melodramatic ramblings of new characters like Quess and mr.jealous-cybernewtype (who's name I'm not going to remember because hey, the writing doesn't deserve that kind of attention) Its one of the many reasons that film feels compressed, vague and disappointing.
'And hey, CCA came out over 23 years ago. Maybe you should find a new character to bitch about, or a new fandom to like?'
I'm not going around with an avatar saying 'I hate Quess', neither do I obsess over the film, but when CCA is mentioned she certainly stands out as one of the many reasons the film fails. Regardless, I think it might be more that people find it a little creepy/obsessive that you're so focused on a character who's series is long-gone (and short to begin with) and who's role wasn't even that noteworthy.
You are, however, going out of your way to reply to an old-ass post in a support community that's meant to be a refuge from the kind of bullshit we're venting about, trying to defend said bullshit.
And hey, if people can still bitch and moan and scream about how Ghinius is the devil incarnate (which believe me, they still do), don't I have the right to defend him? Oh wait, I forgot. Only popular opinions are allowed in the UC fandom. It's perfectly okay to bitch and moan and bash minor characters years after their series' heyday to the point of it being creepy (ever read the shit some people say should happen to Quess? Hell, even Ghinius) as long as that's what more people than not think. But defend, like, and appreciate them? Oh no, can't have that.
|Date:||December 7th, 2012 09:32 pm (UTC)|| |
I actually really liked Ghinius. I won't try to defend him or claim that he was a really nice guy the whole time. Maybe he was, until he stopped taking his medication and little by little came unbalanced... so much so that his pet project and victory over the federation came to dominate his mind. He was tragic, and yes, he was kind of a bad guy, but he was a bad guy done well.
I'll also take this chance to rail against Char, who was really only a good character in my opinion when he was calling himself Quattro. I thought his motives were petty (when he had any at all), and his character progression nonsensical. His long standing rivalry with Amuro has no political or rational basis other than the fact that Amuro injured Char's pride, and the duel at the end of 0079 has absolutely no meaning behind it. He selfishly uses pretty much everyone he ever came in contact with. He tries to destroy the Earth he once preached to save as part of the AEUG. The fact that they try to rationalize his character in CCA by suddenly having him announce he has mommy issues completely de-legitimized his character for me forever. A true leader of men should be much less petty.
Zechs was a better Char than Char. At least his motivations seemed to have some more logic and sense behind them.
See, I disagree with you that Char isn't a good character. I think he makes sense and is wonderfully complex, it's just the key thing to remember is HE'S NOT A GOOD PERSON. He's a fucked-up, petty, exploitative extremist. The issue is when people try and paint him as some kind of hero, which is all kinds of fucked up.
And yay, Ghinius love. I'd be hesitant to say he was a good person too, even pre-breakdown. He clearly had underlying issues that'd been going on for years, and I personally feel like he had self-destructive, unhealthy tendencies before his final break. But a lot of that is mental illness and a result of his circumstances, and not all of that he can help. I just see him as... IDK, a complex, overall neutrally aligned person who committed evil acts during a mental breakdown? If that makes any sense.
I hate char as well.
To me he is a monster. He's reason for joining zeon during the war was to get revenge on the zabis for killing his father. I already have problems with this, one there is no proof degwin zabi poisoned his father, two he swore revenge on all of the zabi even tough its more than obvious none of the children (except perharps gihren) had anything to do with this, three garma was his friend and kycilia trusted him he killed them both, four he joined zeon and commited murder after murder on the people of federation, to kill 5 people he helped kill milllions wtf. I hate how everyone in zeta trust him and treat him as a hero when he did all of this specially, amuro and hayato whose homes and family were killed or gone crazy in the first episode of gundam. This is why i sometimes hate tomino its like he is insulting our inteligence.
I also hate bright noa because he is giant jerk, who does plenty of mistakes on first gundam yet the fandom refuses to see this, has awful social skills (which in my opinion are neeeded if your a captain in charge of a military crew), he didnt help amuro when he needed the most in the first gundam, and if he does proove to be a team dad of his team is for the female character who hardly need the help needed like fraw bow or mirai. I also hate his bright slap and the supposed effect it is suppose to have.
Oh yeah. I don't think Char is much better than Giren TBH. They're both fucking monsters. Really interesting, complex monsters, but monsters none the less.
And yeah, I don't hate Bright but he does definitely have his flaws and ugly traits the fandom tends to ignore. Like, I think he's interesting but holy shit in MSG especially does he have problems. I think he's really similar to Jack Crawford from the Hannibal Lecter stuff (ESPECIALLY Jack in the new TV series) in that he wants to do the right thing but can be more than a little ends justify the means about, especially with the nasty habit of treating people under him like tools and disregarding their mental health. Granted Jack never physically abuses his answer to Amuro (Will Graham), but still.
What kinda funny is that the Hannibal fandom is pretty quick to see Jack's flaws and some people are even too harsh on him, while as the UC fandom completely ignores or tries to justify Bright's and paints him as this hero of manliness or something.
So you agree with me, tomino was kinda insulting our inteligence in zeta with all the char is a hero declarations.