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August 2nd, 2010

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10:24 pm - Strike Three, Tales of Fanbase.

If this is the third time I'm having to bring up the Tales fanbase here, then we got some major bull here.

First of all, there's this game Namco is publishing for developer Ninja Theory called Enslaved.  It may seem like I'm getting off topic here but here's the thing.  The Tales fanbase is hating on Enslaved (and the game is not out until October).  Why are they hating on Enslaved?  Because Namco's very focused on promoting this new IP when the fans act like they should be focused on localizing every single Tales game out there instead.  While there was a cocky remark from the PR department that managed to enrage them even more, I've seen worse in the cocky PR department (like Denis Dyack with Too Human and calling out everyone criticizing the game from a bad impression of demo builds).  They're giving off unjustified hate towards Enslaved.  I mean, the game looks like it could turn out to be good from the demo I played at Comic Con as long as the game itself doesn't get screwed up.

Moving on, recently, it seems like those Tales fans have made so many posts on Namco's Facebook, getting seriously irate over the whole non-localized Tales games.  Their walls covered up with the fans' angry posts and even when Namco themselves post some of their business releases (like "Check out something related on *insert game here*"), it's affected there.  Heck, I see an example when Namco themselves make a mention of the Street Fighter X Tekken/Tekken X Street Fighter games Capcom announced at Comic Con and see a response like, "Who cares about Tekken?  We want Tales!"  Yeah, because I don't actually care about Tekken, nonetheless that I want to learn to get good enough at Tekken 6 for tournament play...oh wait, yes I do care about Tekken, particularly that way.  I can't help but think it's pretty pathetic.

Yeah, they say Namco was asking for it but, honestly, isn't it such a trivial thing to get worked up over?  Do you really feel you're entitled to it?  Honestly, this really proves to me the fanbase has such a self-entitlement problem.  I mean, even I have to admit that Tales is pretty low on the niche RPG series (I even admit Shin Megami Tensei is higher on that pole).  I'm even confused if the fans even liked the series they're so angry for not getting.  A lot of times, the series comes off as a generic RPG series for many people (and the reason I hear people losing interest in the series), and that's just me playing Devil's Advocate here.

Yeah, I know there's the whole, "Tales of Graces F" for PS3 just recently but, I rather not get into that one.  (I have my own thoughts about it in regards to it and in relation to the long run for the series but I'm not going to get into that).

Even if I feel I should be angry over Namco for their practices, it's nothing like the way the Tales fanbase acts like.  Also, I got my own problems to worry about over some company not localizing some RPG series.  I really question the maturity of the fanbase.  No wonder I lost so much faith in the Tales fanbase.  Hating on an unrelated game because you're not getting a localized Tales game and filling Namco's Facebook with countless irate posts that questions said maturity.  Yeah.

Now if you excuse me, I got to get some practice on Tekken 6...because, you know Tales fan, I actually care about Tekken and Tales isn't the only thing I care about from Namco.
Current Mood: annoyedannoyed

(7 comments | Leave a comment)


[User Picture]
Date:August 3rd, 2010 09:25 am (UTC)
Tales fandom suuuuuck.
What amazes me is how they're so ready to criticize every game in the series but Legendia (because Legendia is teh best game evurr with godlike music and u need to diaf if u don't agree - on the Tales Forum at least, because funnily enough, the game's not very liked on other boards) and claim they don't have faith in the series etc... and then whine they don't get the new ones. I mean, Tales is Tales. Even if they try new things, it's still gonna be a lot like the others (that's what makes the charm of the series for me but that's another story), so why do they absolutely want those games? To better criticize them later? =/

Also, they apparently know better what Namco should do and why they're in financial loss etc. Yeah right.
[User Picture]
Date:August 3rd, 2010 11:04 am (UTC)
It continues to baffle me too. I have come to terms that the series will always have these clichés (even that, "There's nothing original under the sun"), but I'll still love the series. So it's pretty redundant to even think that. But apparently, that's what it sounds like. They just want it to criticize it to hell and back.

Yeah, I question if they, ones without business degrees, know what to do. They act like they know better than some people with business degrees. Truthfully, I'll find delicious irony in seeing Enslaved make money. Yeah, the game they hated on so much actually making them money to go through with a localize Tales for the ungrateful fans. That'll be interesting to see.
[User Picture]
Date:August 3rd, 2010 10:53 am (UTC)
If you look at some of the business decisions Namco's made (releasing Graces in Japan a week before Final Fantasy XIII? WTF? And before that they released the DS Tales right before Dissidia came out.), then I'd say they are sort of asking for some of it.

On the other hand, it's a corporation, they want MONEY. So of course they're going to promote the thing that will bring them the most of it. And unless they get more money right now, there won't BE a Tales series anymore, so I'll happily buy something else they release. *idly wonders when the next Soul Calibur game will appear*
[User Picture]
Date:August 3rd, 2010 11:24 am (UTC)
Yeah, I'm not trying to say they're resolved of everything. I was mainly aiming at why they're hating on Enslaved and spamming their Facebook page in regards to the "They are asking for it." thing, i.e. localization issue. I do have my own beef with Namco (The Director's Cut thing they do on many occasion for Tales is something that concerns me in the long run for the series), but, hey, I rather not go overboard with it. Oh, and I do agree about the move of releasing Graces in Japan in the same time period as Final Fantasy XIII (that's just suicidal for any RPG).

And what you said there is true in regards to promoting what is bound to get them the most money.
[User Picture]
Date:October 20th, 2010 01:15 pm (UTC)
Thing is I think the tales fandom in general just has a problem admitting that the Tales Series is in fact a very niche series even in the western JRPG community, possibly even more so than Dragon Quest and a hell of a lot more than the SMT franchise which includes Persona. It doesn't help matters that there so many Tales games, which i guarantee that even if they come out in America the Tales fandom would even buy all of them, they'd be too busy with other RPGs, or they might not have the money, and even then by the time they do another Tales gets announced and so that gets their attention instead. They know this though they won't admit and Namco Bandai also knows this.

Its not that they're getting the short end of the stick, its that there is no profit in releasing the Tales series overseas. You can see this just form looking at the Tales forums Tales series other games and yet they do not have their own sections, and very few people talk about them. They are not like the Mother(Earthbound) fandom, who actually are much more devoted to their series, and even then look of the time discrepancy between their games.

The tales fandom though loud is very small, and if Namco wants to earn a profit they have to tap into the interests of the RPG community in general which from what I've witnessed does not hold the same interests as the Tales fandom. Just look at Legendia, though the Tales fandom loves it actual RPG community thinks its a pile of crap, and I can't blame others for disliking it either. Say what you will about the character side-quests but you shouldn't have to go through a side-quest in order to find out about X character, the game should take some time out to actually give out some of the character's story in the main storyline itself, side-quests should just be use to elaborate on those points, and it doesn't help if the side-quests are easy to miss, and only allow you one chance to enter into it. Not everybody wants to do that, not everyone likes to go through side-quests, without incentives.

What makes it worse is when they try to compare themselves to much larger JRPG communities, that are actually much more understanding whenever they don't get a game in the franchise, some of them just take take matters into their own hands and either translate the the games they wanted or make their own (eg: Most fandoms for Square-Enix games, Mother fandom, Shin Megami Tensei fandom).

Its really very sad.
[User Picture]
Date:October 21st, 2010 12:44 pm (UTC)
Interesting this entry I did still gets some response.

I have to say that you share the same thoughts I have in regards to this series and its reception. Also, you worded it very nicely. (I actually do think Shin Megami Tensei is higher on the popularity scale than Tales)

The interest level in Tales games. I do argue that the many games they put out does cause a problem. I wouldn't say most people have cared about Tales of Phantasia since 2005 or somewhere around there. I'll even put it this way. There's only up to two people I can think of (in fact, don't need to think about it) that would care about Narikiri Dungeon X. Not to mention, it was from my Tales fandom in the past.

Tales of Legendia...being a Tales fan, I actually used to like the game, but then I come to the realization that it wasn't really that good. I even figured out the criticism about why the Character Quests (i.e. the extra chapters after the first half of Tales of Legendia) had horrible character development (it was a bunch of character development exposition...bad ones). They certainly react so badly over the criticism of Legendia.

As for the fan translation...I find that they'll be so impatient about it or lose it if it's not finished or never worked on again. I am not going there for I picture it'll be ugly.

Once again, nicely worded.
[User Picture]
Date:October 21st, 2010 04:48 pm (UTC)
Shin Megami Tensei sells millions, especially the Persona series, so yeah your right it more than the Tales series. The Star Ocean series, and the .//Hack series are also a heck of a lot popular than the Tales series. Also while the Tales Series is more Japan its still not that much popular than your average JRPG series. In fact when Japan did a countdown of the best JRPGs in the last ten years and only one Tales game made it on the list (points if you can figure out which one it was).

Thing is Dragon Quest operates a lot like the Tales series, in that they games are very similar to one another not much is changed in between games, and yet its more popular. The only difference is that Dragon Quest is a Turn-based RPG franchise (which banks off of nostalgia) that is not released often (there are a total of nine flagship Dragon Quest games the series the first game came out in the 1980s) and gets a hell of a lot of promotion when they do (the last two Dragon Quest games sold a hell of a lot better than Square-Enix anticipated).

When Tales of Vs. came out nobody cared, When Tales of Narikiri Dungeon came out nobody cared, when half the mothership tales games come out nobody (not even the fans) cares. So its stupid to pretend that its insanely popular even amongst the JRPG fans because its not.

The funny thing the Tales series is in the same boat as the Nippon Ichi games, and yet that fandom doesn't bitch and moan (okay they do it a little bit but then they move on) whenever they don't receive a game (read: La Pucelle Tactics Ragnarok).

Thing about Legendia is that I received the game for free from my cousin's best friend (who is also an JRPG fan, I was really after his .//Hack and Star Ocean but I settled for Legendia) who said that the game was a piece of crap. His complaint was that he couldn't bring himself to care about the characters, and it just wasn't fun to play because the controls sucked, and I agree with him, the controls for it were horrible, and I already gave my piece about what I thought about the character side quests. Sure the music was good but I've heard better, and more original music in other RPGs, so it wasn't impressive to me at all.

They should try waiting ten years to receive a sequel to your favorite RPG, actually have that sequel be damn good, and then not get a release in their country due to the fact that it came out late in that counsel's cycle and the current CEO of the counsel the game came out on doesn't really care for the game at all, despite the large (and still growing) fandom. Or better yet they should try making their own full 3-D remakes and sequels with re-made sometimes orchestrated soundtracks to older games and to be 80% with both only to receive a C&D letter from the game company, and then actually get a re-make of that game that frankly isn't as good as what they were working on before, and with no sequel in sight.

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